Forum:God

Since the series emphasises on religion as well as history, why is there no Assassin's Creed wiki page for God? ParadisecityXO (talk) 21:51, July 13, 2014 (UTC)

Because the series explains that the deities you see in various religions are just deified First Civilization members, but the series hasn't established who the Christian God is. Slate Vesper (talk) 21:59, July 13, 2014 (UTC)

It should.  The Christian God, Muslim God, Jewish God (who are all one in the same), is pretty much the focus of the positions of the powers that be, over the centuries in the Holy Land, Italy, Instanbul, etc.  And would make a lot of sense if the First Civilization were Nephilim who ruled the world before God made Itself known to the world once more. —unsigned comment by ParadisecityXO (talk · contr)

The First Civilization are a pre-existing species who created humans as a docile workforce and controlled us via an impulse they implanted.

It has never been established that there is a God almighty, and if anything, He would have been a very influential First Civilization member who supported humanity's efforts in the Human-First Civilization War, considering how the other First Civs were deified as they were. Slate Vesper (talk) 23:01, July 13, 2014 (UTC)

The Encyclopedia explains that the gods of the old Greek, Etruscan, Roman and Indian pantheons are the First Civilization. God has no known relation to the First Civilization. Out of Christianity, Islam and Judaism, at least two of their most important figures were known to have been in possession of a Piece of Eden (Moses and Jesus), and they most likely would have mistaken the First Civilization as a singular 'God'. This error is backed up by Rodrigo's misunderstanding of the existence of the First Civilization, believing God to rest in the Vatican Vault. That alone establishes 'God' to be a metaphor for the First Civilization in the ACverse.

In short: no, at this point, I believe there is definitely no God First Civvie in the ACverse. -- Master Sima Yi _Talk 23:10, July 13, 2014 (UTC)

Closest thing we had to Christian God stuff was how Jesus had the Shroud of Eden to perform the miracles, and Moses had the Staff, or an Apple, to part the Red Sea. --Kainzorus Prime ^{Walkie-talkie} 23:33, July 13, 2014 (UTC)

So all the gods in every culture known to man (who were looked upon as gods anyway), were real with the exception of God Itself being the only nonexistent one?  That's just retarded.  I think Juno cryptically mentioned God when Desmond and them were at the Santa Maria near the Colosseum in Brotherhood.  One might think they really were angels ("The heroes of old, me of renown"), Desmon's old man said something about it in AC3.  Also on Jesus, wouldn't it be implied he really was the son of God (since it only resurrected him and no one else it was tried on; the failed attempt at resurrecting Brutus with it, for example), and wearing the shroud was a coincidence (the biggest one in the world one might think)? ParadisecityXO (talk) 07:28, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

To me it makes sense, also considering that by the time Judaism, Christianity and Islam were founded the First Civilization were already extinct. What Juno was referring to in the Santa Maria in Aracoeli was 'time'. "Almost did we have the means. But time... time erodes us. We can distract him. We can see past him. Feint left when he strikes right. But his reach is so very long. His stamina unending. We cannot evade his grasp. Not forever." William did refer to the First Civilization as the Nephilim, yes - "We saw the Nephilim there. We seemed like grasshoppers in our own eyes, and we looked the same to them." - but more often than not the First Civilization are referred to as "the gods", Brahman being the most recent example. Also I think I'm fairly certain that we can say in AC canon Jesus was not the son of God, and was also not a real miracle worker. Brutus technically was revived by the Shroud, albeit for a short period of time, and the same effect may also have happened for Jesus. -- Master Sima Yi _Talk 08:42, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

Time is a concept, so why would she refer to it as "he", "his ", "etc.?  And Brutus reanimated for 5 seconds (corspes sometimes do that, I don't know the name for it, but sometimes corpses in the morge sit up for a few seconds and open their eyes or let out a breath (like if someone held their breath when they die), you know what I mean?), Jesus however was fully resurrected.  Btw on the Jesus subject, in Altair's codex (11); he listed the exaggerated similarities between Jesus, Horus, Krishna, Mithra, etc. even though the similarities weren't thought of until recently by Christ Mythicists, how would he think of that?  ParadisecityXO (talk) 22:04, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

So what you're saying is "Altaïr can't think of something because this group of people didn't think of it". That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. There's no reason Altaïr couldn't think of it. --Crimson Knight _Intercom 22:09, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

I don't know why she would. But it would make no sense for her to talk about God there as it is completely random and unrelated to anything. I don't know why Minerva and Juno would refer to themselves in the third person either in AC2 and ACB. As for Jesus' resurrection, we know nothing of this in AC canon. The only thing we know about Jesus is that he had the Shroud and might have had an Apple of Eden as well. In addition to what Crimson said, Altaïr could have gained this insight using the Apple, similar to how he was able to develop a gun several centuries before the arquebus was developed. -- Master Sima Yi _Talk 22:14, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

...Father Time? Makes perfect sense to me, since giving pronouns to inanimate objects/concepts differs between cultures. Juno certainly comes from a different culture, to say the least. -Molotov.cockroach (talk) 03:33, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

How is God "completely random and unrelated to anything" Juno said (everything she said was random and cryptic (most of it, we came to understand later on) ), or even the First Civ themselves?  And I meant how could Altair list the exaggerated similarities between Jesus and the demigods when the Christ Myth theory wasn't propagated until recent centuries?  Also, in response to "I believe there is definetly no God First Civvie in the ACverse", how can you be so sure? ParadisecityXO (talk) 21:59, July 17, 2014 (UTC)

Because, believe it or not, fictional characters are allowed to have original ideas before they occurred historically. Ezio had the Hidden Gun before guards were seen using guns, so why don't you call that out too? Finally, how can you be so sure that there is a "God First Civvie"? Your arguments don't make any sense.--Crimson Knight _Intercom 22:48, July 17, 2014 (UTC)

Come to think of it, there is the Father of Understanding page. General impression it gives is that the Templars at least profess faith in a monotheistic deity. Seems to be analogous to monotheism as the FC is to pantheism. Both myths propagated by humanity intentionally or otherwise.--Hawki (talk) 00:13, July 18, 2014 (UTC)