Talk:Elijah
Parentage[edit source]
Given the location and time of his birth, and given the vague dialogue, this has to be Desmond's son. However, I realize that there is one alternative; it could also be William's, as the boy's patrilineal line is exactly the same as Desmond's, and leaves out Desmond's matrilineal line. Thoughts? -- Master Sima Yi Talk 12:23, October 31, 2015 (UTC)
- William doesn't strike me as the type who'd cheat on his wife, highly unlikely. As for his ancestry, any ancestor from your father's side is your patrilineal ancestor by definition. Your paternal grandmother and all of her ancestors are your patrilineal ancestors by the simple fact that they are the ancestors of your father. The Wikia Editor (talk) 12:54, November 3, 2015 (UTC)
- There is also a third possibility, the boy could also be the son of a not yet introduced brother of William, thus being the nephew of William and the cousin of Desmond and sharing their patrilineal lineage. Or if we put aside the location and time of his birth, and the dialogue obviously mentionning that he is related to Desmond, he could also be a distant cousin of Desmond like Kaczmarek, with whom he shared many ancestors while not being directly related. Maxattac (talk) 10:59, November 10, 2015 (UTC)
- Probably a distant cousin or an illegitimate cousin. Not Kaczmarek though since his line came from an illegitimate kid of Ezio, meaning its unlikely he's connected to the Kenways. Is no one going to talk about the child's midwest ancestor? This gave me hope for a 19th century midwest AC game. If we ever have one of those, we'd probably meet the unnamed female Assassin from the comics. Misphantom (talk) 11:22, November 10, 2015 (UTC)
- Desmond was already mentioned to have an ancestor in the Nineteenth Century American Midwest in a list in ACIV (on his father's side), so it's not really a surprise.
- I'll admit that the lack of mention of Desmond's matrilinial line leaves some room for interpretation until we learn more. I personally doubt it's a distant cousin, the ancestry seems way too close for that. Plus the location and time of birth all point to Desmond as the father, but like I said, we'll have to wait and see. The Wikia Editor (talk) 12:36, November 10, 2015 (UTC)
William doesn't strike as the type to sleep around, with his personality sex would be the very last thing on his mind. He's like Batman very asexual. But your matrilineal line is your mother's side, your grandmother on your father's side would be included in the patrilineal side. Kryptonian25 (talk) 02:10, November 27, 2015 (UTC)
Should this not be titled something less definitive until the (probable) Desmond connection is confirmed in fifty games' time? I mean, is there anything stopping them from saying the kid is Desmond's secret younger brother? Or a clone? Or accidentally youthed and sent back in time by the Grand Temple? Vetinari(Appointment) 00:26, November 28, 2015 (UTC)
I don't see why it should be something else, born in New York in 2005. He is Ezio's, Connor's descendent as is Desmond. Kryptonian25 (talk) 00:47, November 29, 2015 (UTC)
- It's pre-empting the narrative. The story hasn't told us he's Desmond's son yet. It hasn't said he's related to Ezio or Connor let alone Desmond yet either. It's dropping hints, sure, but it could be a red herring or the plot could shift massively between now and when it's expanded on. Plus the first three messages of this thread are people saying it's ambiguous including the guy who made the article. Might as well say David Jones is definitely David Bowie. Vetinari(Appointment) 18:00, December 2, 2015 (UTC)
- I agree we might have jumped the gun on this article a bit, even if the hinting is rather transparent. I'm a bit stuck on what we should name this article instead though. Crook The Constantine District 18:09, December 2, 2015 (UTC)
- Something less interesting like "Ten-year-old Sage"? Vetinari(Appointment) 19:16, December 2, 2015 (UTC)
- I agree we might have jumped the gun on this article a bit, even if the hinting is rather transparent. I'm a bit stuck on what we should name this article instead though. Crook The Constantine District 18:09, December 2, 2015 (UTC)
The hints are obvious I mean who would this kid have as ancestors in those time periods? Yusuf, Stephane, Machiavelli? It's very coincidental.Kryptonian25 (talk) 21:30, December 2, 2015 (UTC)
Common, we all saw how it happened. Ardant didn't tell Gramática directly because she wanted to give him a surprise, and assumed it was obvious to Gramática only by seeing those hints. This boy is related to Desmond somehow. Also, the boy lives in New York, and Desmond was living there in 2005. DipsonDP (talk) 03:01, December 3, 2015 (UTC)
It was eluded to way back in AC Brotherhood that Desmond had a son.Hugues de Payens (talk) 03:37, December 10, 2015 (UTC)
- That plot thread was also explained in Black Flag as being part of an alternate reality where Desmond had a son. Crook The Constantine District 10:38, December 10, 2015 (UTC)
- Actually... it shouln't be from Desmond! There's no mention of the Materilineal line OF Desmond (not from the Son) and it should be mentioned. You may say: "It's Desmond patrilineal line, not the Son's one" BUT if that is right, then there shouldn't be any "Renaissance" since Ezio had a daughter, Flavia, and she is Desmond's ancestor, not Marcello (Marcello is my Canon, i have been saying this to Darby since Revelations). 3 Options: Or that line is the Patrilineal line of the Son (Which would mean that Desmond has a close cousin, which came out from Connor's children or his grandchildren, and that he is the father) or the Flavia thing is an oversight or Flavia's father in law represents the "Renaissance". Now that i see it, Option 3 makes sense and keeps Desmond as the father. DipsonDP (talk) 04:05, December 22, 2015 (UTC)
- Patrilineal line: "Father of the father of the father..." DipsonDP (talk) 04:09, December 22, 2015 (UTC)
- It's pretty obvious by this point that Abstergo uses "patrilineal" and "matrilineal" as shorthands for "through the father" and "through the mother" respectively. Neither Altair nor Ezio are from an unbroken chain of one gender. Altair fathered Sef who, in turn, fathered two daughters whilst Ezio fathered Flavia. I also doubt that Connor is a fully patrilineal ancestor, unless his wife happened to have the last name "Miles", which was then passed on to their children. Like I said, it's a shorthand, not a literal "father of the father... etc." type of thing. The Wikia Editor (talk) 10:18, December 22, 2015 (UTC)
- There are. As shown here: [1]. It's explicitly stated to not be a full list, only containing time periods deemed "most interesting". Similarly, Isabelle Ardant obviously didn't give Alvaro a full list. She only gave him a couple specific time periods and let him connect the dots himself. The Wikia Editor (talk) 22:20, December 22, 2015 (UTC)
Move[edit source]
Shall we move this to "Desmond Miles' relative" to avoid any speculation alltogether? -- Master Sima Yi Talk 10:49, February 11, 2016 (UTC)
- While this could be categorized as speculation, it's almost certain that the character in question is meant to be Desmond Miles' son. I'm personally opposed to a move. -- Zero-ELEC (talk) 18:35, February 11, 2016 (UTC)
"Almost certain" still counts as speculation at this point. -- Master Sima Yi Talk 19:11, February 11, 2016 (UTC)
- Granted this is three months later but isn't stating he's a relative of Desmond Miles at all speculation as well? (I still think the page should be moved to something that doesn't join-the-dots before the games tell us. Especially when any confirmation could be a year or more away now.) Vetinari(Appointment) 09:52, May 20, 2016 (UTC)