Talk:Abbasid Caliphate - Revision history

imported>Sol Pacificus: /* Appearance in AC1? */

2022-09-04T20:51:21Z

Appearance in AC1?

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:51, 4 September 2022
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	::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
	:::Articles on governments is also simultaneously an article about the state, and one criterion for a state is bounded territory, i.e. a state is both a place and an organization. An easy way to think about this is to ask if you guys would think it makes sense to say the United States of America appears in a work set in some place in Europe, Asia, or Africa, where an American official appears. Well, there are British officers in ''Chronicles: India'', right? Should we say that Britain appears in ''Chronicles: India''? I think it is a fair question, but I would also say no.		:::Articles on governments is also simultaneously an article about the state, and one criterion for a state is bounded territory, i.e. a state is both a place and an organization. An easy way to think about this is to ask if you guys would think it makes sense to say the United States of America appears in a work set in some place in Europe, Asia, or Africa, where an American official appears. Well, there are British officers in ''Chronicles: India'', right? Should we say that Britain appears in ''Chronicles: India''? I think it is a fair question, but I would also say no.
	:::I think what would complicate the question would be if we consider the Abbasid Caliphate's territorial jurisdiction to overlap with the Ayyubid Sultanate due to the technical vassalage status. In this time period, states can actually be considered to have overlapping borders despite this not often being properly drawn in modern maps. See [https://en.~~wikipedia~~.org/wiki/File:~~Map_France_1030~~-fr.svg this map of the Kingdom of France], with many feudal states in vassalage to the Kingdom of France. The situation with the Abbasids was more complicated since as caliphs, they were technically supreme to all other Islamic states, but I think by this point, their status was more akin to the pope than an emperor. (I'm not an expert in Middle-Eastern history so someone correct me if I'm wrong). [[User:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#990000;font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:17px">'''Sol Pacificus'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#D4AF37;font-family:Californian FB;font-size:11px">(Cyfiero)</span>]]</sup> 20:46, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		:::I think what would complicate the question would be if we consider the Abbasid Caliphate's territorial jurisdiction to overlap with the Ayyubid Sultanate due to the technical vassalage status. In this time period, states can actually be considered to have overlapping borders despite this not often being properly drawn in modern maps. See [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Map_France_1477-en.svg this map of the Kingdom of France], with many feudal states in vassalage to the Kingdom of France. The situation with the Abbasids was more complicated since as caliphs, they were technically supreme to all other Islamic states, but I think by this point, their status was more akin to the pope than an emperor. (I'm not an expert in Middle-Eastern history so someone correct me if I'm wrong). [[User:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#990000;font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:17px">'''Sol Pacificus'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#D4AF37;font-family:Californian FB;font-size:11px">(Cyfiero)</span>]]</sup> 20:46, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

imported>Sol Pacificus: /* Appearance in AC1? */

2022-09-04T20:46:45Z

Appearance in AC1?

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:46, 4 September 2022
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	:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
	::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
			:::Articles on governments is also simultaneously an article about the state, and one criterion for a state is bounded territory, i.e. a state is both a place and an organization. An easy way to think about this is to ask if you guys would think it makes sense to say the United States of America appears in a work set in some place in Europe, Asia, or Africa, where an American official appears. Well, there are British officers in ''Chronicles: India'', right? Should we say that Britain appears in ''Chronicles: India''? I think it is a fair question, but I would also say no.
			:::I think what would complicate the question would be if we consider the Abbasid Caliphate's territorial jurisdiction to overlap with the Ayyubid Sultanate due to the technical vassalage status. In this time period, states can actually be considered to have overlapping borders despite this not often being properly drawn in modern maps. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Map_France_1030-fr.svg this map of the Kingdom of France], with many feudal states in vassalage to the Kingdom of France. The situation with the Abbasids was more complicated since as caliphs, they were technically supreme to all other Islamic states, but I think by this point, their status was more akin to the pope than an emperor. (I'm not an expert in Middle-Eastern history so someone correct me if I'm wrong). [[User:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#990000;font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:17px">'''Sol Pacificus'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Sol Pacificus\|<span style="color:#D4AF37;font-family:Californian FB;font-size:11px">(Cyfiero)</span>]]</sup> 20:46, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

imported>Soranin: /* Appearance in AC1? */

2022-09-04T15:02:20Z

Appearance in AC1?

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:02, 4 September 2022
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	As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate? – [[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate? – [[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
	:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
			::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

imported>Darman36 at 14:20, 4 September 2022

2022-09-04T14:20:12Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:20, 4 September 2022
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			{{Talkheader}}
	==Appearance in AC1?==		==Appearance in AC1?==
	:As technically [[Saladin]] was a vassal of the [[Abbasid Caliphate]], can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate.[[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate? – [[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
			:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

imported>Francesco75: Created page with "==Appearance in AC1?== :As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate.~~~~"

2022-09-04T09:56:00Z

Created page with "==Appearance in AC1?== :As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate.~~~~"

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==Appearance in AC1?==
:As technically [[Saladin]] was a vassal of the [[Abbasid Caliphate]], can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate.[[User:Francesco75|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:02, 4 September 2022
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	As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate? – [[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		As technically Saladin was a vassal of the Abbasid Caliphate, can we considered that the Caliphate appeared in AC1 even if Damascus and Jerusalem were parts of the Ayyubid Sultanate? – [[User:Francesco75\|Francesco75]] ([[User talk:Francesco75\|talk]]) 09:56, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
	:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)		:I'm not sure. By that logic, would we say that England "appears" (diplomatic law aside) just because a character meets a representative of a local English embassy? Unless someone has a better explanation, I say my vote is "no". – [[User:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Old English Text MT;font-size:15px;color:#">Darman</span>]] ([[User talk:Darman36\|<span style="font-family:Viner Hand ITC;color:#">talk</span>]]) 14:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
			::I also vote no. - [[User:Soranin\|Soranin]] ([[User talk:Soranin\|talk]]) 15:02, 4 September 2022 (UTC)